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PostPosted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 4:57 pm 
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Hi all,

Thanks for this great forum on folding kayaks. I've owned an older Super TSF since 2001 when I bought it for $50. I remember as a child seeing ads for Folbots in the back of National Geographic and wanted one since. It apparently had been left outside for a number of years and unfortunately, it needs a bunch of work (it's been so long since I looked at it that I've forgotten what) that I thought I'd be able to take care of in a couple of years. It has now sat disassembled in my basement since then without my ever having paddled it. I believe that I determined the year it was built through an email exchange with Folbot at the time, but those emails appear to have disappeared as I've moved from computer to computer and I no longer have that info. There are a number of wood parts, some of which have decayed and, as I remember, the skin was not in good shape. Sitting in the basement, probably hasn't helped.

Still driven to own a Folbot, last year I bought a 1994 Yukon from the Dayton Ohio Canoe Club http://www.daytoncanoeclub.org/ for $450. It's in pretty good shape and I've paddled it a few times since then and enjoyed it. My wife and I plan to be traveling and car camping over the next few years now that we are both retired and having a folding boat to take along that can be stored in the car or trailer seems like it would work well without having to worry about it being stolen easily.

I would like to have a deck and spray skirt for it. When I compared its dimensions to those that were on the Folbot website last year, it seems to be a bit shorter, but I failed to download the specs before the website went away. Mine is 11' 10". So I assume that even if I could find a deck and spray skirt for it, they would likely not fit. I've seen some discussion of spray skirts in the Folbot part of the forum and will likely read more on them and ask for help once I have a bit more time.

There is some wear on both the bottom and top of the hull, but it looks from reading on the forum there are ways to take care of these without too much problem. I also have the original repair kit that came with the boat when it was new that may be of help.

Looking forward to being part of this community.

Fritz
Cincinnati
2014 Yukon
Old Super TSF
Mad River Explorer (kevlar)
1982 Mohawk 17' (royalex)


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:38 pm 
knight of the folding kayak realm
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Location: inland Pennsylvania, USA
As far as spray skirts, I have always been able to find them for all my kayaks and I have owned more than a dozen boats including 5 different folding kayaks. Just measure length and width and then look at the charts for companies like Harmony, Seals and Snapdragon. . For a folding kayak you want what is called a touring skirt, made of nylon fabric, not neoprene. The fabric ones with bungee cord in the edge to fit over the coaming are more adjustable and put less tension on the coaming than neoprene.

Harmony makes some inexpensive nylon touring skirts that are very adjustable by tightening or loosening the bungee. Their Fusion model comes in 9 sizes, certainly one should fit your boat: http://www.harmonygear.com/products/672 ... Skirt.html

Sometimes you have to be creative in outfitting older boats. I have an older 12' Pakboat Puffin I got used that had a very stained and ugly deck (unlike Folbots, Pakboats' decks attach around the gunwales with velcro). Pakboat had some old stock of decks from boats they no longer made and I bought one cheap. It turned out to be 3" too short so I literally cut it in half and spliced a strip of vinyl coated matching fabric to extend it (sewed it on a regular sewing machine using needles designed for leather) and stitched and glued velcro to the edges of the splice. It works perfectly. Since my boat is 12' and I had to add 3 inches to make it fit, the deck I bought was around 11' 9", close to the size you say your Folbot is. Of course it would have to have similar width and taper. Here is a link to what I did so you can see if these decks look like they might be adaptable to your boat: http://www.flickr.com/photos/snapdoodle ... 3639707309

I do admit I'm a little puzzled about your describing the Yukon as having a separate deck. Maybe you are meaning something other than "deck"? The deck is the entire top surface of the kayak. The only versions I've ever seen of the Yukon had the deck an integral part of the the skin, attached to the hull. But maybe the some older version you have is different? If that is the case and you want to make an outline sketch of your Folbot and mark all the measurements on it -- width every foot and distance of the cockpit from the bow and the stern as well as cockpit dimensions, I can measure the deck I got from Pakboat and see if it is close to the same dimensions. You would have to sew and/or stitch velcro around the perimeter of your boat for it to work -- since I'm not familiar with Folbots I don't know if that's feasible. I believe Pakboat is still selling some of those old decks and the prices were good -- less than it can cost to buy the materials to make something like that, and the cockpit coaming and handles are built in (the cockpit would need to align with your seat and frame).

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 4:38 pm 
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Perhaps I'm using the wrong terminology for what I'm looking for. I was under the impression that Folbot made a two part cover for the cockpit. One covering the front half or so of the cockpit (what I'm calling the deck) and the back part incorporating a spray skirt attached somehow along its front edge to the fabric covering the front half of the opening. My cockpit opening is a triangle with the long edges curved a bit. The long axis of the triangle is about 54 inches, the short leg at the back of the cockpit is about 17 inches. I can see that the largest Harmony skirt might be modified to cover the whole thing, but I think the bungee would have to be removed and replaced with some other way of fastening the skirt to the washboard (combing) perhaps velcro. Unlike hardshell kayaks I've seen the Yukon does not have lip that the bungee could grab. Instead it has vertical sides with several knobs sticking out that allow you to remove the washboard by unscrewing them.

Any thoughts about how to create a spray skirt that would work or where one might find one that would fit would be appreciated.

Fritz
Cincinnati


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2017 12:45 am 
knight of the folding kayak realm
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Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 10:46 am
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Location: inland Pennsylvania, USA
I have some suggestions for aiding in skirt retention or even creating a "lip". I have a handbuilt skin on frame Greenland kayak and the cockpit coaming is a keyhole shaped bent wood hoop that goes straight up (perhaps like your Folbot.) The original owner of the boat stretched a road bicycle (thin) tire tube over the outside of the coaming like a giant rubber band - the rubber helps a standard sprayskirt grip the edge. You might also be able to split some rubber or plastic tubing and faster it over the edge of the coaming rim to create a bead that the elastic could grip beneath.

If you know anyone who sews, you could buy a Harmony skirt that is larger than the dimensions of your cockpit, and then cut it down to match the actual outline and have the seamstress (or seamster) re-stitch the channel with the elastic in it along the edge of the trimmed piece.

It's not a difficult process. I've modified too large skirts before and made many custom cockpit covers (for storing and transporting my kayaks to keep bugs, critters and moisture out). I sew on a 100 year old Singer treadle. If you can use most power tools, you can sew. I've taught a bunch of guys to do it. In fact, I've found a lot of men are better at machine sewing than women -- handy skill to have! The tunnel (the part that fastens around your torso) is the tricky part so as long as you have a skirt where that fits you, modifying the deck is not that tough. If fact, for a cockpit that is oversized like yours I would also stitch a long strip of casing straight across the front of the skirt deck about halfway and slide a fiberglass wand or a flexible flat plastic stay of some kind in the casing to elevate and stiffen it so that it is less likely to pool water and implode. That would be a little tricky, but I know a lot of folks are good at visualizing and engineering such modifications.

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Current:
Feathercraft Wisper
Pakboat Quest 135
Pakboat Puffin 12
Pakboat Swift 14
Greenland SOF
P & H Easky 15LV
Previous:
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Feathercraft K-1 Expedition
Pakboat XT-15


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 23, 2017 2:38 am 
lord high faltbotmeister

Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:51 pm
Posts: 602
Location: Colombo, Sri Lanka
You can also very easily attach an epoxied rope lip extension to your wooden coaming to compensate for an overly large spraydeck
See earlier thread on this below
http://foldingkayaks.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=4285&hilit=Nautiraid+rope+coaming+epoxy

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Simon

Pakboats Quest 135, Nautiraid Narak 460, 416 & K1 (sold my 550), First light 420, Feathercraft Wisper, Fujita Alpina AL-1 400, Incept k40 (for sale)
Non-folders: Cape Falcon F1. Beth sailing canoe, 2014 Hobie Adventure Island


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 7:06 pm 
faltbootemeister
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Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2013 5:36 pm
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Location: west burbs of Chicago
If you're interested in a factory spray deck system and a rudder as well, Amazon has one left.

https://www.amazon.com/Folbot-Expeditio ... rds=folbot

Not cheap, but it will fit your boat. and it also includes the repair kit and longeron padding kit which is VERY hard to find.

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Five Folbots - Super TSF, two GIIs, Kodiak, Gremlin


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:02 pm 
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Flatwater, thanks for the heads up on the kit for the Yukon.

If I remember correctly the dimensions of mine are different from more recent ones. Mine is 11' 10". When I checked last year on the specs on Folboat's now defunct website, listed dimension were different, maybe 13' long. Unfortunately, I didn't record that info and don't remember what they were.

Do you have any idea whether these would work with my 1994 Yukon?

If the spray skirt was not quite the right size, I probably could modify it, but I wonder whether there were any changes in design since 1994 that would make the rudder kit not work.

Given the price, I'm hesitant to buy the kit without a better idea whether design changes might make it not fit. Amazon says it has more of these coming, so perhaps not crucial to grab this one right away until I've done more research.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:12 pm 
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Also found the spray skirt alone: https://www.amazon.com/Folbot-Spray-Fol ... rds=folbot

What is the padding for the longeron listed in the expedition kit? Could this be cobbled together from locally purchased materials?


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:34 pm 
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Just found the dimensions of the modern Yukon on REI.com. It lists the length as 13 ft. x 30 wide. With a cockpit opening 59 in long and 20 in wide. My boat is 11' 10" with a cockpit opening about 50 in long and 17 in wide. I didn't measure the width of the boat as that seems irrelevant to whether a spray skirt would work.

The larger cockpit opening on the modern one would likely mean having to modify the spray skirt, but perhaps that wouldn't be too hard.

Any thoughts about this, would be appreciated and whether the rudder kit would work on my boat. It's clearly set up to take a rudder kit, but it's possible that design changes would mean the modern one wouldn't work with mine.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 25, 2017 7:18 pm 
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Ok, I took a chance and ordered the spray skirt, rudder kit from Amazon. Should be here mid-week. Depending on the instructions that come with the rudder system, I may need advice. It seems likely that I'll have to downsize the spray deck to fit my smaller cockpit. It seems like that shouldn't be too difficult.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 5:37 pm 
faltbootemeister
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Joined: Tue Nov 26, 2013 5:36 pm
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Location: west burbs of Chicago
If your boat is 12' long, are you sure it's not an Aleut?
The cockpit of an Aleut is listed as 47" x 20" which is also much closer to your dimensions than the 59" x 20" of a Yukon.
Do you have the factory assembly instructions for your boat?
If not, the most recent versions can be found here:
http://jeeps-folbots-etc.co.nf/folbot/N ... nuals.html

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 10:10 pm 
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The Ohio boat registration card that the seller gave me listed it as a 1994 Yukon. It is 11' 10" long. I remeasured the cockpit, the inside dimensions are longer and narrower than the Aleut, 50" x 17". I also measured the beam just before I started to write this reply, it's about 33 inches, a bit wider than the Aleut. The listed width for the Yukon is also 30" so that's not a decider.

I have a hull identification number if that would help identify the boat: FLB00721F494.


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