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PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:34 pm 
knight of the folding kayak realm

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:42 pm
Posts: 468
Hi all,
I recently acquired a pair of Careen outriggers plus sailing gear. Unfortunately the outriggers came without the parts that attach the inflatable booms to the kayak by either mast attachment or bridge. See second illustration here for the mast attachment: http://www.careen.eu/#/EN/Outrigger%20o ... ustrations . And here for bridge attachment: http://www.careen.eu/#/EN/Outrigger%20o ... ustrations

I’ll try to attach my photos of the outriggers (minus attachment) below too.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4fy22o6c54mpr ... 0.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/nncqde4hyn8ao ... 7.jpg?dl=0

It appears that Careen are no longer in business (although their webpage still exists, they aren't replying to email or letter and Klepper appear to no longer stock their stuff). Still I thought it might be worth asking here just in case anyone here knows of any shops that might have stock of replacement parts for Careen. Or else has a Careen outrigger with either mast or bridge attachment who might be able to help me fabricate one by giving me measurements, or better yet has one for sale.

I'm fully expecting to have to try and get one made. And if I do, it occurs to me I could try and get two parts fabricated. One to provide the level outriggers that Careen seem to have originally provided, i.e. floats resting on the water when sailed level; and a second that might provide 'flying outriggers' like the British Open Canoe Sailing Group use--with these the outriggers are 'flown' out of the water when the boat is sailed level, but still provide a margin of safety in a gust as they allow the boat to heel, and thereby spill wind, while stopping it heeling so far as a capsize.
See here for example: http://www.solwaydory.co.uk/products/sa ... utriggers/

Anyway, any thoughts or ideas welcome.
All the best,
Ian


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:37 pm 
knight of the folding kayak realm

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:42 pm
Posts: 468
https://www.dropbox.com/s/doidna7t434dk ... 0.jpg?dl=0
(last photo that couldn't attach to the other message)
I


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 6:47 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1146
Location: isles of scilly UK
One way is , find a piece of aluminium tube, (or stainless, which would be heavier).This tube is for the centre piece, The internal diameter needs to be the same as the OUTSIDE diameter of the outrigger tubes you have. They need to be long enough to protrude out from the boat. I see from your photos that the pop up pins are there which is good. A short distance in on the tubes you find you will have to drill holes of the diameter (size) of the pop up pins, the further in these holes are the better, so make sure the tube you find is long enough The tubes you have found need to be clamped to the coaming with J clamps, kleppers might be too short but I have said in an earlier post where you can get longer ones from (I have used the term pop up pins as I can,t remember the correct name for them). The photos I have attached show my outriggers with two arms, in your case there will be one which is ok.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 9:34 am 
knight of the folding kayak realm

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:42 pm
Posts: 468
Thanks, John. That's good advice (as always). I'll see if I can find your post about the j-clamps. In your picture, have you simply drilled through the tubes for attaching the j-clamps, or can I see some sort of plastic clamp involved?
Thanks again.
Ian


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 03, 2018 11:12 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1146
Location: isles of scilly UK
Ian. The outrigger set up in the photo is a Russian one and there are plastic clamps that are around the cross tube. On my Folbot Yukon I did drill through the tube. I first found some dowel that is a nice fit in the tube and I put it in, so I coudn,t squash the tube by over tightening , if that's possible. I also put a piece of wood across as you can see in the photo but I don,t think that would be needed on a Klepper,s wood coaming, Folbots is Aluminium and the Klepper style J bolts can,t be used. If you need J bolts longer than Kleppers then go to http://www.faltbootsegel.com (they also have another site). I paid them through a NO fee system, Kleppers longest J bolt, if you need to know it is 3 1/2 inches, or 87mm. I have been looking at the outrigger systems made by faltbootsegel, they bolt through the tube, slots in the tube make it easier for mounting. They have inflatable pontoons and some very nice ones made from ply. It should be quite easy to make ply ones if transport is no problem. Although you already have the Careen ones.


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 3:48 am 
knight of the folding kayak realm

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:42 pm
Posts: 468
Thank you again for the very helpful detailed information. I'm away on work for a few days now, but will hopefully be able to have a go at all this when I get back--or later this summer in any case.

All the best,
Ian


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2018 6:02 am 
faltbootemeister

Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 4:10 pm
Posts: 174
John, I would love to see a photo of how the crosstube was attached to the Folbot coaming.

_________________
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Folbots: Too many. It's embarrassing.
Feathercraft: Aeronaut
Klepper: AEI - Jonathan Waterman's boat
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:57 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1146
Location: isles of scilly UK
Folbot put their outriggers just behind the sail, but, when I fitted my Kayaksailor sail on my Yukon that location is not really possible. ( I know the kayaksailor sail dosn,t really need outriggers,but) So the only place to fit outriggers was behind the seat. Folbot have a sort of J bolt that hooks in holes in the coaming (washboard). I thought that was a lousy system. At the back I drilled holes in the coaming for bolts that would go through the 4x2 that goes across the coaming and through the cross tube, you will see the set up in the photos. They are left SLIGHTLY loose to make it easier. Pretty simple and it works. Now if I take the Yukon out I should change to stainless steel hardware, plated was ok on the Great Lakes but now I am on the sea. Perhaps Boshield 9 or Corrosion X will make the plated hardware ok.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:04 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1146
Location: isles of scilly UK
I have been looking at the Careen outrigger system. Is there any way to find out the volume of their pontoons? Also both UK klepper dealers still show the system supplied by Klepper, it dosn,t mean they have any but it might be worth it to contact them. I don,t think much of the Wayland copy, but it might be ok.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:34 am 
faltbootemeister

Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 4:10 pm
Posts: 174
Thank you for the excellent photos, John.

_________________
Ann and me
Folbots: Too many. It's embarrassing.
Feathercraft: Aeronaut
Klepper: AEI - Jonathan Waterman's boat
Hardshells x6


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2018 5:12 pm 
knight of the folding kayak realm

Joined: Wed Oct 07, 2009 6:42 pm
Posts: 468
john allsop wrote:
I have been looking at the Careen outrigger system. Is there any way to find out the volume of their pontoons? Also both UK klepper dealers still show the system supplied by Klepper, it dosn,t mean they have any but it might be worth it to contact them. I don,t think much of the Wayland copy, but it might be ok.


Thanks for the idea. I also had that idea, but contacting the UK dealers they let me know that Klepper no longer sells the system. One of the German forums mentioned that Careen is no more -- I think the post was dated a few years ago. So it appears that the dealers are a little slow to update their websites.

I like your self-reliant suggestions for constructing one's own fittings. Thanks again for the very helpful photos. I'll have a go once I'm back in the country and let you know how I get on.

All the best,
Ian


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