Falco Folding Kayak

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siravingmon
lord high faltbotmeister
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:51 pm
Location: Bangkok, Thailand

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by siravingmon »

Looking forward to your report Tom,

Particularly curious about how much wave-induced flex you notice in the plywood sides between the bulkheads and what effect, if any, this has - I'm guessing the aluminium guides to the sliding sections will help stiffen this up? :-)

Simon
Simon

Feathercraft Wisper, Firstlight 420, Fujita Alpina AL-1 400, KXone Airrow 17, Nautiraid Geenlander 1, K1, 416, Narak 460 (sold my 550), Pakboats Quest 135, TRAK 2.0
Cape Falcon F1, Beth, Hobie AI
AE Air Fusion Evo wanted, Incept k40 for sale

Yostwerks

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by Yostwerks »

Looking forward to your report Tom,
Here's several pics from paddling today at the base of the foothills (6,000ft elevation). The Falco tracked well, and turning was quick.
It seems to be a bit faster than my old K-Light. All things considered, not bad for a $125.00US folding kayak :D

No winds / waves to speak of, but it will see plenty of that on the still frozen mountain lakes later this Spring.
Particularly curious about how much wave-induced flex you notice in the plywood sides between the bulkheads and what effect,
if any, this has - I'm guessing the aluminium guides to the sliding sections will help stiffen this up?
No side flex that I could detect. The Falco 16 should be completed tomorrow, unless I go skiing :mrgreen: ... I'll post pics.

Use the {BACK} key to return from the links below....

http://www.yostwerks.com/FalcoPaddle800A.jpg - In the bag (48 X 12 X 6in)
http://www.yostwerks.com/FalcoPaddle800B.jpg - Ready to unfold
http://www.yostwerks.com/FalcoPaddle800C.jpg - 5 minutes later !
http://www.yostwerks.com/FalcoPaddle800E.jpg - On the water
http://www.yostwerks.com/FalcoPaddle800F.jpg - I didn't notice till later that I had forgotten to attach the forward deckridge :roll:

Lodeon

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by Lodeon »

Please Tom, tell us more.
Does it perform better than the sonnet and than your older folding kayaks?
There is no need to tell you again that I love your projects and so far your best one seams to be the newest. (That is a good reason to wait for the high volume single/double version) ;)

gmchrislive

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by gmchrislive »

Hi Tom,

I'm usually forum lurker but just HAD to register to congratulate you on this - it's a great concept and possibly even more than the sonnet due to the more basic design using plywood etc.

Gotta couple of things buggin me - how you make the coaming ring fold with the boat?
How do you attach the aluminium strips to the ply?- i had in mind a sort of ply envelope- a bridge spanning the top and bottom strips- may be stronger?
Do you think a 3-hole 16ft falco is feasible as use either as a single or double (with spare coamings covered )

I haven't been in a kayak for years but I'm tempted by the falco, not sure if the greenland would be stable enough for a novice like me.

Anyway - nice work !!!!!!

trigger

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by trigger »

Yostwerks wrote:
I'll post pics.
Please do!

With a successful test paddel of the Falco 12, I have high hopes for the Falco 16. It would make a nice addition to my ever growing yost fleet of boats.

Yostwerks

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by Yostwerks »

Thanks everyone for your comments :)
Does it perform better than the sonnet and than your older folding kayaks?
I'll need to paddle both boats in all conditions before comparing them to my other designs.
I didn't finish the Falco 16 yesterday as the unseasonably warm temps "forced" me into going for a long
motorcycle ride :D

http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16Coaming788A.jpg - Falco 16 pics... Estimated cost $150.00US / Estimated build time 75 hrs.
How do you attach the aluminium strips to the ply
Epoxy ... I've been doing it this way for many years. The aluminum channel vs wood channel is thinner allowing for a smaller folded thickness.
The Falco 16 acually folds smaller overall than the Falco 12 as the plywood panels are 46.5" vs 48" for the Falco 12. ( 47" X 12" X 6" overall)
Do you think a 3-hole 16ft falco is feasible as use either as a single or double (with spare coamings covered )
Yes ... I'll be building the Falco Double next. It will be like the Falco 16 in length only. Width will be about 26" and there will be
either 3 coamings with the center one being smaller and round, or possibly one washboard style coaming. It will look much like the Falco 12.
how you make the coaming ring fold with the boat?
http://www.yostwerks.com/CoamingFold3.jpg - The clear vinyl is a water tight seal at the coaming take-apart connection.

Please do not attempt to build these boats until I've thoroughly tested them and added detailed instructions to my site.... Later this year.
I'll likely be making changes / additions as is normally the case.

Regards, Tom

siravingmon
lord high faltbotmeister
Posts: 679
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:51 pm
Location: Bangkok, Thailand

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by siravingmon »

Congratulations on your successful first trial Tom, and many thanks for the report - I like your coaming ring joint waterproofing solution!
PS the Falco 16 looks stunning in black :-)

Simon
Simon

Feathercraft Wisper, Firstlight 420, Fujita Alpina AL-1 400, KXone Airrow 17, Nautiraid Geenlander 1, K1, 416, Narak 460 (sold my 550), Pakboats Quest 135, TRAK 2.0
Cape Falcon F1, Beth, Hobie AI
AE Air Fusion Evo wanted, Incept k40 for sale

Yostwerks

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by Yostwerks »

Thanks Simon,

Here's a few pics of the completed Falco16 folder

LOA - 16'
Beam - 21"
Weight - 26lbs
Assembly - 6 min.
Cost to build - $150.00

http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16J4.jpg - Falco 16

http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16J5.jpg - Frame

http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16LD.jpg - Coaming and rigging

http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16LE.jpg - Roll-up deck hatches

http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16LF.jpg - Folded (47" X 11" X 7")

trigger

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by trigger »

Tom,

You should be very proud of this design/invention. It really is a beautiful looking boat for the cost to produce. I hope it's paddling performance meets your standards, and is available to build soon. I foresee this exceeding the sonnet in popularity among builders.

Yostwerks

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by Yostwerks »

You should be very proud of this design/invention. It really is a beautiful looking boat for the cost to produce. I hope it's paddling performance meets your standards, and is available to build soon. I foresee this exceeding the sonnet in popularity among builders.
Thanks for your comments. I plan to paddle the boat tomorrow or Monday.

Tom

gmchrislive

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by gmchrislive »

Hi Tom, I have to agree with the other posters and say the Falco 16 looks really smart in black- if Batman ever had to use a kayak, this would be it! (would suit a yellow bat logo on the bow!)

I notice in the 16 the ply sides are not enclosed in fabric like they are in the Falco 12, are they treated with varnish or do you simply plan on not getting them wet? I was also wondering whether the ply sections will try to slide together due to the induced rocker, and if a locking catch/block may be needed at each join to stop this and prevent creases in the skin? I only thought of this after seeing how some sof frames have a construction that stretches the skin.
Having said that, if you find it isn't a problem, then great. (if it ain't broke don't fix it eh)


Looking forward to your report!

Yostwerks

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by Yostwerks »

Hi Tom, I have to agree with the other posters and say the Falco 16 looks really smart in black- if Batman ever had to use a kayak, this would be it! (would suit a yellow bat logo on the bow!)
Thanks ! .... All black is a commonly used color with Greenland style kayaks. I've skinned several this way over the years.

Here's a couple of my folding kayak designs in all black ..

http://www.yostwerks.com/MarkCover3.jpg - Sea Rover
http://www.yostwerks.com/MarcelB.jpg - Sea Ranger
http://www.yostwerks.com/DillonFold5.jpg - Sonnet Inflatable
I notice in the 16 the ply sides are not enclosed in fabric like they are in the Falco 12, are they treated with varnish
All Falco wood has been sealed , even that under the PVC. This is really no different than on a non folding wood SOF.
All bare wood is sealed with the same HH-66 vinyl cement used to glue the PVC skin. HH-66 is an excellent wood sealer.

http://yostwerks.com/NikumiPaddle1.jpg - Nikumi (Watco oil sealed)
http://yostwerks.com/SeaRiderClearA.jpg - Sea Rider (urethane sealed)
...or do you simply plan on not getting them wet?
LOL !
I was also wondering whether the ply sections will try to slide together due to the induced rocker, and if a locking catch/block may be needed at each join to stop this and prevent creases in the skin? I only thought of this after seeing how some sof frames have a construction that stretches the skin.
Not an issue. I've paddled the Falco 12 several days and noticed nothing like you describe.
Please explain the SOF skin stretching you mention above ?

Regards, Tom

gmchrislive

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by gmchrislive »

"Stretching" the skin was probably a bit misleading, I think I mean't "tensioning" really but couldn't think of the right word.
It was a mechanism on a folding open deck canoe, that was vertical handle that pushed the keel end plate out about an inch when you rotated the handle down. (in the same way a door handle rotates to move the latch in or out).

I saw it online but can't find it now. Typical eh.

Yostwerks

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by Yostwerks »

It was a mechanism on a folding open deck canoe, that was vertical handle that pushed the keel end plate out about an inch when you rotated the handle down. (in the same way a door handle rotates to move the latch in or out).
I'm with you now. Feathercraft calls them stretcher bars. Initially I thought you were referring to side to side, not fore and aft. The Falco cross sections are hinged, and when they are opened, this creates side stress on the plywood frame panels which stretches the hull skin a bit ( side to sde).

On the Falco, the keel comes together at the center, and the effort of pushing down to get the aluminum center tube sections together before sliding on a sleeve provides some stretch fore and aft, but it'd not really necessary. My homebuilt aluminum / HDPE folders ( Feathercraft like ) use no stretcher bars, but this is simply a matter of making construction easier for homebuilders.

Regards, Tom

Yostwerks

Re: Falco Folding Kayak

Post by Yostwerks »

Here's some pics of the Falco 16 at a small lake today. It was more stable than I had anticipated.
I need to paddle on a larger windy mountain lake as soon as the ice melts to really give it a proper trial.

http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16Paddle1.jpg
http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16Paddle2.jpg
http://www.yostwerks.com/Falco16Paddle3.jpg

Tom

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