Folding Kayaks Forum

The user forum for FoldingKayaks.org
It is currently Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:43 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: After long last...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 3:43 pm 
I finally got out for my first paddle in my new Ute today! Let me tell you it's been one of those years where every time I've planned to go out paddling something has come up to stop me. Well not today!!

Image

I went for a couple hour paddle around the Orangeville reservoir. A nice little lake that has great spring feed waters that are calm and warm at this time of the year. I had a great little paddle. It took me a bit to get my sea legs back underneath me but once I relaxed I had a great time. I didn't find the boat "tippy" at least no more than any of my other boats but I could see how if you are a nervous paddler the Ute might feel a bit shaky at first. I think Marks Ute mkii will be better in that regard at a 28"beam. That said I wouldn't want mine any wider but that is just me. It did really track well and when I got back into my cruising paddling rhythm I was quite impressed at it's speed. I bet I was going just as fast as I go in my 17' cedar strip.

Image

I'm really pleased at this great little boat and with the great folks at Long Haul Kayaks! Tammy and Mark run a first rate business and I cannot recommend anybody higher if you want to get a great folding kayak! Now I just have to stop things from getting in my way from getting on the water!! LOL Life's short, Paddle often!!

Image


Last edited by wainair on Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:55 am, edited 2 times in total.

Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:31 pm 
knight of the folding kayak realm

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2011 9:22 am
Posts: 382
Location: Coastal New Jersey
Handsome boat! Looks very well made and, of course, Long Haul kayaks have a reputation for durability. I see that you're using a Greenland paddle. Does the cockpit coaming interfere with your paddle stroke in any way? Did you encounter any problems [other than lack of practice] in the assembly process? Good Luck with your new boat!

_________________
Feathercraft Kurrent 2.0 (Pippin)
Epic GPX


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:20 am 
Hey Jake. Yes I was also trying out my new greenland paddle from Northern Lights Paddles. It is a really nice paddle. Feather light, easy to stroke with amazing power but then again with 5000+ years of development to get that shape I would expect it to be exceptional. Though I think I will have to tie on some drip strings like you see on the real eskimo paddles. With each stroke I was putting about a quarter cup of water into the boat. I do have the sprayskirt for the boat but it was a humid 32C yesterday and I didn't want to seal myself in in that heat.

The coaming on the boat doesn't get in the way at all. It is low down by your hips so with your arms in their natural paddling position is well above the coaming. The boat is very easy to assemble. The first time I assembled it I did it in about a half hour now I can do it in about 15-20 minutes. You just need to remember to do everything. When I first went out I thought the boat was handling a little weird, then I looked down and realized I hadn't clipped the skin into the coaming. So back to shore I went to deflate the sponsons and clip the lip in. Back out on the water and the boat was handling much better, more stable and overall smoother. It really is exactly what I wanted.


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Thu Jul 05, 2012 10:49 am 
Here are a few more pics I forgot to post...

Image

My original Aleut Kayak I named Tiamat's Toothpick. Seeing as the Ute is a skin on frame boat as well I though Tiamat's Toothpick II seemed appropriate! Tiamat is, in the Babylonian mythos, a chaos monster, a primordial goddess of the ocean who gave birth to all the later gods. The name has also been used in some old Bibles for leviathan.
Image

The boat came in 2 boxes and was well packed.
Image

Unpacking is always fun. Just like Christmas as a kid!!
Image

Image

The boat also came with an assembly manual and a video. The Video is a great idea and really make putting the boat for the first time a snap. Once built I thought I would see if my dog and I would fit in the boat together... well we do but I don't think she likes the idea too much! LOL
Image
Image

Maybe next week I will try to take her out in the boat too! I'll wear swimtrunks!

I didn't mention it before but I also had them add the rudder mount on the back so if I want to add a sailing rig down the road I can.


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 4:59 pm 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1379
Location: South Salem, NY
Hey Wainair, Congrats! Looks great!

I've actually been paddling my Ute a lot as well. Good move getting the rudder attachment. I just picked up a Kayaksailor rig and played with it on the Ute the other day. It sits a little high because of the cockpit peak but the lee boards did reach the water and the boat sailed well in moderate wind. Without a rudder I had to use my paddle to steer but tried going without as much as possible. I'll probably talk about this more over in the sailing column. Here's a question for you... my Ute tracks like it's on rails and I actually find it a bit of a chore to turn it - with a lot of upper body mass I'm always just a bit tentative with this boat for strong leans, but I do lean 'out of the turn...' and she comes around slowly. Curious what your feelings are about this? Sometimes I think the boat might benefit from a little something between the deck and the hull to round her out a bit more. But, I'm not that great a paddler so I'd be interested in your experiences.

I've been fishing and snorkeling quite a bit with the Ute and have also found some great ways to get back in after I capsize or roll out for swimming (with the aid of a paddle float).

Dennis

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Sat Jul 07, 2012 5:39 pm 
I'll have to paddle the boat a bit more before I make any firm judgements on how quickly it turns. It does track very well for such a short boat and maybe there is a bit of tradeoff in the tight turning department. I am a bit top heavy too so I know what you mean by not wanting to lean out to much. I didn't have any problems getting where I wanted to go with the normal repertoire of power strokes and steering/J strokes.Though this week I think I'll just go out with the swim trunks on and really push it's limits as best I can. I am a novice paddler too. If you look at the boat on dry land with no one in it, it looks to have a bit of a negative rocker. That would help it track better but but it would slow the turning too. Personally I'd rather have the tracking. I'd rather work a bit harder for a couple seconds to turn it on a dime than to have to constantly correct a zigzagging boat on a long afternoon paddle.

I'll have to trip over into the sailing section and read up on your sailing experiences with the Ute. I am not in a rush to get a sail this year but I am still interested in it for the future! Don't you think an outrigger set up be better for the narrow Ute?


Top
  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2012 11:11 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1379
Location: South Salem, NY
You're right about preferring tracking over turning. I have a Klepper T9 with lots of rocker and I can't really paddle it in a straight line and it's exhausting. But, my stroke improves every time I paddle that boat.

You should definitely spend some time in the water with this boat if you can. There are a couple of issues that kinda surprised me the first time I went over. The biggest, was that I couldn't get back in using my tried and true cowboy rescue. The boat is just too narrow unless you have exceptional balance - mine is pretty good, but no match for the Ute. I now carry an inflatable paddle float with thirty feet of yellow floating line. Depending on what I'm doing I usually tie one end of the line to the bow and have the float either in the cockpit under my legs or on the back deck. If I don't plan on using the float unless capsized I put it on the back deck. If I think I might want a stable platform for snorkeling or re-rigging something on the boat I'll keep it where I can access it without getting in the water. The line is just nice to have to keep yourself, paddle, and boat all connected - especially if conditions deteriorate. I've used the line as a paddle leash in questionable weather...

By far the easiest way to use the float is to inflate it on the end of the paddle and then connect the paddle across the cockpit with the paddle tie down straps. Extended way out to one side it makes the boat very stable and using a rolling hitch you can easily make a step tied to the paddle (close to the boat) and literally climb the ladder back into the boat. Obviously using the float for standard re-entry is possible and stable using this technique as well. One tip, when you use the D-rings, make sure the loose end is on top and not wrapped under the paddle shaft - this sounds more obvious than it actually is because of the twisted angle the perpendicular mounting creates. Getting the straps loose if tucked under can be more than challenging after being tightened. Once mounted, the paddle can become a seat in the cockpit useful for bailing, rigging, or simply resting.

One more thing that surprised me about the Ute was the difficulty in getting the water out. The cockpit is small and I find it difficult to use my canvas bucket inside the cockpit. The peaky cockpit allows a fair bit of draining while inverted and lifting it in the water. But it won't get close to the majority out. Fortunately, a quick capsize won't put too much water into the boat. But, trying to drain water from the bow by lowering the stern and then raising it - will only flood the boat completely. Filled with water the Ute is about as stable as a 13' log - inside or out.

I picked up a portable pump (Atwood - runs on 3 'D' cells) that rides behind my seat (tied to the frame). After a capsize I turn it on before I do anything else. The Ute holds a lot of water even with front and rear air bags - too much for the hand pump that I still carry but never use.

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2012 11:19 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1379
Location: South Salem, NY
Yes, outriggers will offer the best solution for all out speed, especially something like the Balogh system which has actually been tested with a Ute by David Valverde the current owner of BSD.

But, a system like Kayaksailor seems a good alternative for those days when you might want to (or need to) paddle a bit while out. I also really enjoy the challenge of sailing a kayak. On a larger boat like the AII you could pull the outriggers in and store them if you wanted to paddle - not easily, but you could do it. That space just isn't available on the Ute.

If the Ute is your only boat the 1.4 rig might be a better choice. I'll be posting my findings with the 1.6 in the sailing section.

D

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 10:38 am 
Thanks for the tips about getting back in. Your idea to use a little portable battery powered pump is a great one. It's much more practical than fussing around with a hand pump or a bailing bucket.

The BSD rig is quite impressive. It really turns the Ute into a sailboat. But before I went whole hog with a rig like that I was thinking of trying a sail kite. My Uncle used to sail his touring kayak with a sail kite. He was only using a rudder but on a shorter boat like the Ute I think a leeboard(sp?) might be a good addition to a rudder as well.

Well with all this talk I think I'm going to go out for a paddle now. Cheers!


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2012 9:31 pm 
Well a few more hours under my belt with the Ute and the boat gets better and better as I get more comfortable with it. I found today it was pulling a bit to the right... I thought that was odd. So I paddled up to shore, everything looked okay but then I noticed my one sponson was inflated harder than the other. I equalized them and went back out and the pull was gone. It is a really quick boat for a 13footer.

I tried some drip strings on my Greenland paddle today and that helped but didn't solve the water in the lap problem. I think if I want to stay dry and use my Greenland paddle I'm going to have to use the sprayskirt. I'll give it one more go with some more strings but I bet I will go back to my current designs paddle for short trips. That is a bit disappointing because I like the feel of the Greenland paddle better. It pulls just as much as the current designs but is easier to paddle. That is it requires much less effort for the same pull.


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2012 3:24 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1379
Location: South Salem, NY
If you find a solution to the greenland paddle dripping please let me know. I get soaked every time I go out because of it, but I just love it too much to stop. How do you like the carbon fiber version?

d

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2012 7:31 am 
It's great. It is feather light and breaks down into three pieces. The build quality is excellent and the finnish is satin so you have a good grip. It also has a stubby centre loom so you can set it up as a storm paddle. Northern Lights Paddles makes it. I originally ordered one with a white boarder that sort of looked like bone edging but they don't make them anymore even though their site still shows it. Of course I can't find it now but I had seen a picture of an Inuit paddling and he had tied a bunch of twine threads about 2/3rds up his blade. I thought I might try to do some more of that and see if it helps. Until I figure it out swim trunks it is! LOL


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:26 am 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1379
Location: South Salem, NY
Have you been out again recently?

I'll be home on Sunday and can't wait to get back out on the boat.

I was at the annual Wooden Heritage Canoe Assoc. gathering this year and one of the paddle makers used the Carrick bend as a water stop. Double ended canoe paddles are much like european paddles though with the blade being much further out on the ends. It's that taper and the big cockpit that kills us. I'm going to have to go take a look at the website you got your paddle at now. Along with making a new lee board I think I'm going to try my hand at carving a paddle this summer... stay tuned.

d

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 10:17 pm 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2005 3:40 pm
Posts: 1025
Location: isles of scilly UK
The Greenland paddle and getting wet. I used a Greenland on my Triak and of course i got plenty of water on my "lap", i solved this with "half a spraycover" in front of me held on with GOOD velcro and a sort of half hoop that helped the water to run off. Also there are drip rings that will go on a one piece paddle if this would help.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: After long last...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 12, 2012 9:58 pm 
Brotherhood of the Golden Paddle

Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:05 pm
Posts: 1379
Location: South Salem, NY
I normally paddle the Ute with a float bag in both the bow and stern. But today I decided to test the buoyancy without those float bags. The test was two fold. 1) I wanted to see if it might be easier to get back into the boat without the float bags and using only the sponsons. 2) I was wondering what the boat would do completely filled with water with just the sponsons for support - and would it support me as well in this flooded state.

I weigh about 200 lbs.

Well, 1), it didn't make any difference. I still needed the float bag to get back in. Trying the cowboy rescue just put the rear of the coaming under water and filled the boat. Trying a side entry just put the side of the coaming under the water and filled the boat. I think I'm stuck with using the paddle float for getting back into this boat.

2) The boat will keep it's coaming well above the water level when filled to maximum with sponsons alone. I was running short on time so I couldn't test bailing with the canvas buck from outside of the boat. With the pump running and bailing with the bucket I think you could get the level down fairly quickly inside the boat for re-entry. I was able to get back into the boat in the max flooded condition but the coaming was well under the water and there was no stability whatsoever. Either the bow stuck up into the air or the stern stuck up into the air. There was not middle ground.

For someone as big as me, I think forward and rear floatation is a necessity in the Ute.

I sure had a great time paddling and playing with this boat today. It leans a lot better than I remembered and I must have improved my paddling because I think it turned a lot easier today as well.

D

_________________
Klepper Aerius II
Klepper T9
Long Haul MK1 Expedition 'light'
Klepper S4 sail rig
Kayaksailor 1.6 +genoa
BSD 36HP


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 16 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group